Ram VM 3.0 Fatal Engine Flaw Discovered

"HammerheadFistpunch" (hammerheadfistpunch) 01/26/2016 at 14:00 • Filed to: None

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So If you want to know EVERYTHING about the RAM 1500 EcoDiesel, you already subscribe to !!!error: Indecipherable SUB-paragraph formatting!!! , This guy knows his stuff, is very scientific and engineer minded in his approach to his truck and puts a crap ton of miles on his truck with a load so he has a fair amount of credability in my book and at 148,000 miles, his ED engine is torn apart because it failed.

(skip to about 3:00 in to get to the heart of the issue)

Turns out that the exhaust cam timing gear has a fatal flaw that allows the gear to slip on the shaft and best case your timing is off and your engine runs bad, worst case it eats your valves.

The sad news is that it sounds like its bound to happen to all these engines eventually.

Hopefully FCA/VM is looking into it.

DrJohannVegas > HammerheadFistpunch 01/26/2016 at 14:03

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One day, the lessons learned about trusting an interference fit on a camshaft (learned from the Yamaha V8 in the Taurus SHO) will finally stick.

HammerheadFistpunch > DrJohannVegas 01/26/2016 at 14:08

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No. No lessons shall be learned!

Nibby > HammerheadFistpunch 01/26/2016 at 14:11

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damn yo

glad I stuck with the Hemi

Saracen > HammerheadFistpunch 01/26/2016 at 14:12

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The same engine is being used in JGC diesels, right?

Takuro Spirit > HammerheadFistpunch 01/26/2016 at 14:13

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Oh cool. Kind of like when MazdaFord installed cam gears and crank gears onto non-keyed shafts and just relied on torque to keep them from spinning loose and smashing valves?

It took them 2 years to add diamond-laden washers (at least thats what I was told was in them) between the gear and the cam/crank to prevent slippage.

HammerheadFistpunch > Saracen 01/26/2016 at 14:13

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Correct.

DrJohannVegas > HammerheadFistpunch 01/26/2016 at 14:14

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HammerheadFistpunch > Takuro Spirit 01/26/2016 at 14:16

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Sounds exactly like it.

FJ80WaitinForaLSV8 > HammerheadFistpunch 01/26/2016 at 14:16

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How on earth did this make it through quality control?

HammerheadFistpunch > FJ80WaitinForaLSV8 01/26/2016 at 14:19

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I guess they aren’t the first company to use this type of fit for the shaft. In theory it should be sufficient but it also sounds like this isn’t the first time a design like this has failed.

RallyWrench > HammerheadFistpunch 01/26/2016 at 14:20

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Ugh. I’ve heard rumblings about issues with these things, but haven’t seen it explained. It’s a little ironic, considering the old Dodge V8s has plastic timing gears with issues of their own.

JawzX2, Boost Addict. 1.6t, 2.7tt, 4.2t > DrJohannVegas 01/26/2016 at 14:21

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VW didn’t learn it...

MultiplaOrgasms > HammerheadFistpunch 01/26/2016 at 14:24

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Something something italian engineering.

vondon302 > HammerheadFistpunch 01/26/2016 at 14:24

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Damn FCA is getting hammered today on oppo.

HammerheadFistpunch > MultiplaOrgasms 01/26/2016 at 14:25

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yup.

HammerheadFistpunch > vondon302 01/26/2016 at 14:25

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I guess I haven’t been paying attention. I just saw this video on my YT feed.

vondon302 > HammerheadFistpunch 01/26/2016 at 14:30

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http://oppositelock.kinja.com/this-is-the-ab…

Takuro Spirit > HammerheadFistpunch 01/26/2016 at 14:33

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At least they can just tack a weld onto the new gear to keep it from happening. It is a dumb ass design tho.

PotbellyJoe and 42 others > FJ80WaitinForaLSV8 01/26/2016 at 14:35

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QC Guy: “We’ll have an issue with this interference fit design, it will break eventually.”

VP of Product: “If we stop for a redesign now, it will cost us $130 per vehicle, plus whatever the solution costs us.”

QCG: “But it will break, around 110k to 160k miles.”

VPP: “So this get through the warranty period without issue?”

QC Guy: “Yes.”

VP: “Good, nothing to worry about.”

QCG: “But it will break.”

VP: “Sure, after warranty. No problem. Thanks.”

nlzmo400r > HammerheadFistpunch 01/26/2016 at 14:39

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Love the info in the videos but I find him impossible to listen to. Just babbling on and on. Get to the point, describe the proposed fix (which he never does). I’d tack a fixed pin in that thing and be done with it. Elegant it’s not, but interference fit was stupid from jump street.

Hopefully they’ll get these sorted out at FCA. In curious if this has been an issue overseas where the engines been used for quite a while.

Future next gen S2000 owner > HammerheadFistpunch 01/26/2016 at 14:41

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Just to be clear, a shaft key costs like, what 10 cents at the volume FCA buys them in.

SidewaysOnDirt still misses Bowie > HammerheadFistpunch 01/26/2016 at 14:46

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The only lesson learned will be that they need to put a bigger engine in it to draw attention from the fact that it’s shit. It’s the Mopar way.

HammerheadFistpunch > nlzmo400r 01/26/2016 at 15:04

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He is long winded...but through

BigBlock440 > FJ80WaitinForaLSV8 01/26/2016 at 15:06

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I’m curious how it made it 5 years until somebody noticed. Though Europeans probably don’t put that many miles on their vehicles, so it didn’t crop up yet.

gawdzillla > HammerheadFistpunch 01/26/2016 at 15:32

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I should be glad I didnt buy one of those over a silverado

but then again, if i were to get a Dodge I’d probably buy that lifetime warranty because I know I’d need it

HammerheadFistpunch > gawdzillla 01/26/2016 at 15:40

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The sad truth.

uofime-2 > FJ80WaitinForaLSV8 01/26/2016 at 16:22

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QC ensures parts are to spec, not that the spec is correct/won’t have problems. This is more likely a design problem.

CRider > DrJohannVegas 01/26/2016 at 17:19

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Tell me more about this Yamaha V8 you speak of.

DrJohannVegas > CRider 01/26/2016 at 17:25

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One Yamaha V8: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ford_SHO_…

Two Yamaha V8: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Volvo_B84…

Three Yamaha V8 (Ha, Ha, Ha): http://yamahaoutboards.com/outboards/V8-5…

nermal > gawdzillla 01/26/2016 at 18:44

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Yep, I looked at these before settling on my GM truck w/ 5.3.

Glad I went the route I did, so far my truck has only needed gas & oil changes. Let’s hope it stays that way.

Rufant v1.0 > HammerheadFistpunch 01/28/2016 at 01:44

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The first I heard of these critical components only being interference fit was on the BMW MINI/PSA 1.6L I4. Where a friend in the industry had to work on one, only to find the crank pulley was interference taper only, no key/keyway. Seems such a basic engineering safeguard (not full proof, my Mazda history has taught me that), I think it just shows the $$$ pressure they are under to save every cent they possibly can.

I read a big article on modern DI diesels last night. I think the days of diesels going on for ever at starship mileages are a thing of the past.

To most people a car/truck is a consumable, like a fridge or a washing machine. Our sort, are the tiny minority...